Vz58

[phaedra1106]

Well a bit of an update, the rifle is at Frankfurt airport. Apparently German security have held up the consignment of Vz.58, apparently they are leaving for the UK tomorrow...I hope!

Any sign of it yet?

[techguy]

I'm quite tempted by one of these.. have an empty .223 slot on my ticket, and can't justify the cost of a straight pull AR...

[Fedaykin]

Indeed I have it now, picture attached

Very pleased with it, so far I have only shot it once. I did have some hard extraction problems but I am not in a panic about that. Not an unusual issue for straight pulls, firstly when I got it home after the first shoot I found the chamber to be rather oily (my fault should of made a better effort of cleaning it before shooting), also I think it should need a good 500+ rounds through it to smooth off the metal and soften the springs (there are two to compress in a vz.58). Next time I shoot it I will make sure it has a nice clean and dry chamber, also I will make sure I have nice clean brass to run through it. 62gr GGG behaved OK, 55gr FNM was virtually unusable with the hard extractions, I had some very old RG with fairly tarnished cases which were also very hard to extract (next time I will give them a clean up with brass cleaner which as suggested by the RCO) and 63gr GECO was hard to extract but usable. To be honest aside from the newness of the rifle the oily chamber probably didn't help. Another thing I don't have a bipod yet on it so shooting and cocking standing meant I couldn't put a s much welly into it! One curious issue is if the case isn't ejected properly it can jam between the bolt and the rear sight block chipping the paint, doesn't bother me too much as a military rifle should have a patina too it and I have a small paint touch up pen to fix it.

I plan to be at Sennybridge F range with it this Saturday and I have some 55gr American Eagle and 63gr PPU as well as the left over stuff which I will give a polish beforehand. I also plan to buy some new RG or RUAG surplus there and see how it runs that. A degree of experimentation will be the order of the day! The test rifles didn't have hard extraction issues so I will run mine in and see how it goes before I give Scott a call.

Oh and as it stands I only have old RG SA80 magazines which are so so when it comes to feeding rounds! Tried to get some new Colt AR15 magazines at the Coventry militaria fair last weekend. I actually phoned D&B sho said they would bring some new ones with them, when I found there stand and had a look the guy pulled three assorted used with rusty springs out of a bag. I politely declined the opportunity wtfwtf Anyhow I think some nice new magazines will also help with feed issues but until I can source them it is SA80 mags for the foreseeable future! Anybody know how quick Lantac is turning around an order for USGI mags?

[phaedra1106]

Thanks for the info, PM sent smile2

[Fedaykin]

Well took it Sennybridge on Saturday and 212 rounds later left with a big grin on my face. The initial teething problems have faded away, it certainly prefers civilian .223 fodder at them moment but even with 5.56 NATO I only got one real proper hard extraction all day. I had taken some 69gr ppu match and some 55gr American Eagle which both fed very well especially the former. The GECO is a bit harder going but I have used that up now and will stick to PPU for the moment. At the ranges I was operating at it was perfectly accurate with 55gr despite the barrel twist not being suited for it. A special mention goes out to James Mumford an RFD from Wiltshire who was shooting with various Com-block guns, on the day he was very helpful getting to grips with the Vz and even gave me a box of steel case .223 to see how it ran. We also got talking about AK (poor man as I will happily talk the hind leg off a donkey on that subject especially how much of a fraud Kalashnikov is - not to denigrate what is an excellent gun) and I will be giving him a call in the future about Mosin Nagant which he sells and I am planning to put in a variation for. Actually the steel case Russian ammo was a real surprise as it fed very well and happily hit the ETR consistently, it was alongside the PPU match some of the easiest feeding of the day. It also fired with a satisfying boom ! I didn't get a chance to see where it came from albeit I don't think it is Barnaul as it has a greenish case.

I am keen to try some 75gr ammunition as the review in shooting sports stated that it ran particularly well in the test rifle.

Another shout out goes to the guys from Hartlebury Shooting Supplies who were also very helpful, I plan a visit to their shop in the not too distant future!

Anyhow 300+ rounds in and the Vz is a rather fun piece of kit which certainly had a few people scratching their heads at Sennybridge along the lines of "Nice AK47"......"It isn't an AK47" ...

A picture of the mystery steel case .223 is attached if anybody wants to take a stab at origins!

[techguy]

I'm getting more and more tempted with one of these!

[pigsy]

I'm considering ordering one in .223 and the spec above looks like the I'd go for, but as ever, a few queries:

I'm a little unsure about twist/barrel length to go for though? The choices are 1:7 or 1:9 with barrel lengths at 12, 16 or 18.5 inches. Also, is it a good idea to chrome line? It would be fed milsurp initially but reloaded once dies purchased. Range would be between 100 - 600 max.

Many thanks

Adam

[Fedaykin]

Really it should be 1 in 9 for 55gr and something heavier 62gr, 69gr or 75gr for 1 in 7. I purchased the 1 in 7 twist 16 inch barrel variant as I was planning to mainly shoot 62gr milsurp and it is the standard variant Caledonian offer.

My experience of shooting the rifle has turned me right off shooting milsurp, I found extraction was extremely heavy going which is not entirely a surprise as military loads are hotter then .223 rem. The rifle is marked up .223 rem and whilst I was told when it was sold to me that Milsurp 5.56 is fine I have decided only to shoot the former. I was concerned about the stress I was putting on the rifle shooting milsurp as well, it is built like a tank but not worth the stress it is easier on my arms and hand anyhow!

As for accuracy, I haven't had a chance to do some scientific testing yet so to say. Maximum range I have shot it so far is 400 yards with the iron sights. It managed to get every shot on the target which impressed me especially as it was getting dusky, I was also shooting steel case 55gr Barnaul on the day. The extraction is very gentle with the steel case and despite the sub optimal 55gr bullets for the 1 in 7 rifle twist it is perfectly accurate at shorter ranges. As I said it was getting onto the target at 400 yards with iron sights and in low light conditions.

I want to try it at 600 yards but I will use more optimal 69gr bullets for that, I found it particularly likes the 69gr ppu and I am fairly confident it should be OK at 600yrds.

The test .223 in shooting sports had the 12.5 inch barrel and he found 55gr ammo was not exactly stellar, my experience with the 16" is much better and really at shorter distances using 55gr was fine despite the less then ideal barrel twist.

Going back to the Barnaul consider this, it cost me £27 for 100 55gr steel case rounds that were perfectly acceptable at 100 to 400 yards. That seriously undercuts milsurp anyway.

My advice get the 16" barrel with a 1 in 7 twist it is still very short even with the massive muzzle break. you have to pay extra for the 1 in 9 twist as it is a special order from Caledonian/CSA. My next advice is for general fun shooting get the steel case and have some better 69gr like the PPU match in stock for more accurate long range shooting until you start reloading. To be honest you are going to struggle to break even reloading .223.

Finally the FAB defence parts finally all arrived and the rifle is now dressed up in all its Gucci bits, need to invest in some for of short eye relief scope and will be having a good look at what is on offer at the CLA. Here she is all finished in the kitchen:

[sconie]

Really nice looking setup you have, I am still on holiday in Tampa right now but intend to drop by CSA upon my return as they are just up the road from me. I am only at the beginner stages in looking for a rifle and had originally looked at SLR's in 7.62 as that's what I used in my army day's.

I never liked the 5.56 round when using the SA80 and much preferred the 7.62 hitting power, what is your advice on both these rounds and the availability of ammo and cost difference ?

Also whilst I'm in the USA is there any gear I should consider bringing back home (legally).

[Fedaykin]

I am still a noob relatively Sconie so I fear my advice might not be as good as from some in this forum.

To be honest FMJ in any calibre can be a struggle to buy commercial these days, I can get FMJ .223, .303 and .308 with a thirty minute drive to Countryman of Derby. Their prices are:

.303 PPU £14.99 for twenty
.223 69gr match grade £14.50 for twenty
.223 55gr American Eagle £13.99 for twenty

Shopping further afield I picked up .223 55gr Barnaul steel case at £27 for 100. I have seen even better prices for Barnaul online then what I got from an RFD in the club so it is worth shopping around. My main issue at the moment is my maximum storage limit for .223 is 200 which is far too small. It means if I stock up on one particular brand I have no capacity to buy anything else. I plan to put a variation in to up it quite a lot! Currently my allocation is 180/200, I was thinking of pushing up to 400/500 thus giving myself plenty of leeway to shop! Considering RG are no longer selling into the civilian market I think it is probably best to start putting the idea of getting surplus on a regular basis out of your mind. You can still get MEN and DAG from ITL but that means dealing with erm ITL which can be fun sometimes.

From what I can make out PPU in .308 is not much different pricewise to .223. In the end I think it boils down to what kind of shooting you want to do. I wanted a straight pull and the simple fact is .223 is a far better choice when you go down that path. I have an empty slot on my FAC for .308 and I plan to fill it with a bolt action (current thinking is a Howa 1500 tricked up with a nice stock and other bits n bobs). I don't reload yet and I plan to in the future but not for cost reasons, when you break the costs down it isn't much cheaper these days. The main reason I want to do it is to make life easier when it comes to keeping ammo in stock, often when I try and buy some FMJ there is none available or limited choice. I am building up a nice collection of brass and intend to reload in the future as a way of keeping myself stocked up.

I am pleased with the Vz setup, I have some nice Gucci bits on it now. Particularly pleased with the retractable rear monopod mounted to the stock.

As for buying from the US don't try any optics it is a restricted Federal item! Reloading bits should be fine I suppose. How about some of those nice ammo cases from Cabelas.

http://www.cabelas.com/product/Shooting ... t104187780

Or some ear defenders:

http://www.cabelas.com/catalog/browse/h ... t104769180

At least a Moss Pawn T shirt! I so want to go on a pilgrimage to their store!