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Re: Unproofed guns in the UK
Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 7:00 pm
by Sandgroper
ovenpaa wrote:The Proof Acts
The provisions of the Acts apply to all small arms, whether of present use or future invention, within certain fixed limits of bore size and projectile weight (with the exception of some military arms made for the use of H.M. Forces). Air guns, are exempt from proof by Proof Act.
The Proof Acts lay down that no small arm may be sold, exchanged or exported, exposed or kept for sale or exchange or pawned unless and until it has been fully proved and duly marked. The Maximum penalty is £5000 for each offence, but with provision for higher penalties where, for instance, the sale of a number of guns constitutes one offence. Alteration to or the forging of proof marks is a more serious offence.
Arms previously proved and bearing apparently valid proof marks are deemed unproved if the barrels have been enlarged in the bore beyond certain defined limits or if the barrel or action has been materially weakend in other respects.
The offence in dealing in unproved arms is committed by the seller, not by an unwitting purchaser.
This is interesting. From reading the bold paragraph, my shortened Winchester could still be in proof as the muzzle of barrel is now thicker (and one would assume stronger) than it was at it's original length.
However,
if I decided to sell it I would still get it proofed, just to be safe.
Re: Unproofed guns in the UK
Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2012 5:10 pm
by Rearlugs
I thought that all unproved firearms and components had to be proved within a certain time of being imported into UK? In fact i thought it was an unfeasibly short time limit, such as 7 days?
Most European proof marks are acceptable in UK.
Re: Unproofed guns in the UK
Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2012 5:28 pm
by ovenpaa
Denmark being a small country does not have a proof house, which was going through my mind when I shot a prototype 12.7mm last year, not a proof mark in sight on the action or the barrel.
Re: Unproofed guns in the UK
Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2012 6:25 pm
by Sandgroper
ovenpaa wrote:Denmark being a small country does not have a proof house, which was going through my mind when I shot a prototype 12.7mm last year, not a proof mark in sight on the action or the barrel.
Neither does the US!
Re: Unproofed guns in the UK
Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2012 6:51 pm
by Porcupine
Sandgroper wrote:ovenpaa wrote:Denmark being a small country does not have a proof house, which was going through my mind when I shot a prototype 12.7mm last year, not a proof mark in sight on the action or the barrel.
Neither does the US!
Nor does Canada, Australia, or indeed most countries in the world. They are a uniquely European hold over from mercantalist times, granting some friends of the government of the day a cosy cash cow for all time.
Re: Unproofed guns in the UK
Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2012 10:04 pm
by Chuck
I thought that all unproved firearms and components had to be proved within a certain time of being imported into UK? In fact i thought it was an unfeasibly short time limit, such as 7 days?
Still think it only applies when you want to sell them. brought my S1 shotgun in from abroad, only proofed when sold....proof office cocked up and I had to pay twice!
Re: Unproofed guns in the UK
Posted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 8:20 am
by R.G.C
Chuck wrote:I thought that all unproved firearms and components had to be proved within a certain time of being imported into UK? In fact i thought it was an unfeasibly short time limit, such as 7 days?
Still think it only applies when you want to sell them. brought my S1 shotgun in from abroad, only proofed when sold....proof office cocked up and I had to pay twice!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commission ... Portatives
Years ago, there was at the old St Etienne Proohouse the 'Musée de l'Epreuve" showing amongst other exhibits, an incredible quantity of firearms of all kinds having failed to pass the proof.....Instructif!!!
Reciporcity of proofing is the rule. A firearm proofed in a CIP country proofhouse can be imported, used in any CIP country...... Bisley being the exception, as a CIP proofed Target rifle has to be 'proofed' again using less than scientific method....
R.G.C
Re: Unproofed guns in the UK
Posted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 9:27 am
by Sandgroper
R.G.C wrote:
Reciporcity of proofing is the rule. A firearm proofed in a CIP country proofhouse can be imported, used in any CIP country...... Bisley being the exception, as a CIP proofed Target rifle has to be 'proofed' again using less than scientific method....
R.G.C
Why is that and what method does Bisley use? :?
Re: Unproofed guns in the UK
Posted: Tue Jan 31, 2012 8:56 am
by Rearlugs
Chuck wrote:I thought that all unproved firearms and components had to be proved within a certain time of being imported into UK? In fact i thought it was an unfeasibly short time limit, such as 7 days?
Still think it only applies when you want to sell them. brought my S1 shotgun in from abroad, only proofed when sold....proof office cocked up and I had to pay twice!
(From the Proof House notes)
"The importation of unproved arms into the United kingdom is subject to control. See Section122(4) of the 1868 Act, amended by the Act of 1978. Notification of importation has to be given to both Proof Houses within seven days and/or the arms have to be submitted to proof within twenty-eight days of arrival in this country. These regulations do not apply to small arms imported by any person for his own personal use while they remain his own property."
Re: Unproofed guns in the UK
Posted: Tue Jan 31, 2012 9:39 am
by Chuck
These regulations do not apply to small arms imported by any person for his own personal use while they remain his own property."
That's US then. So long as not for trade.