The UK's Finest Independent Forum for Shooters and Gun Owners. Est 2010.

bradaz11 wrote:so if it's not tapered, what are you doing to the tip of the bullet? I thought pointing would require you to put the tip into a taper to get it uniform?

Sorry I thought you were refering to the meplat trimmer.
The pointing tool is a different thing all together I will know better to morrow when I have had a go. Im guessing I will drill a small hole in the centre then cut a taper using a minature carbide cutter.
Or maybe a small carbide burr. I have a few of them.

OK I know - more fun but why not buy the actual itty bitty carbide pointing thing and just make the holder - you can it it from Hannam's. If you don't get the actual pointing tip spot on you'll ruin your bullets.

The Gun Pimp wrote:OK I know - more fun but why not buy the actual itty bitty carbide pointing thing and just make the holder - you can it it from Hannam's. If you don't get the actual pointing tip spot on you'll ruin your bullets.

Because they are roughly £58 each and I don't want to pay that.

WHIDDEN GUNWORKS
PDS POINTING DIE SYSTEM (REQUIRES SLEEVE & INSERT) £245.50
PDS-22 POINTING DIE SLEEVE .22 CAL £57.75
PDS-6 POINTING DIE SLEEVE 6mm £57.75
PDS-25 POINTING DIE SLEEVE .25 CAL £57.75
PDS-6.5 POINTING DIE SLEEVE 6.5mm £57.75
PDS-7 POINTING DIE SLEEVE 7mm £57.75
PDS-30 POINTING DIE SLEEVE .30 CAL £57.75
PDS-338 POINTING DIE SLEEVE .338 CAL £57.75
PDI#0 POINTING DIE INSERT # 0 £57.75
PDI#1 POINTING DIE INSERT # 1 £57.75
PDI#2 POINTING DIE INSERT # 2 £57.75
PDB SHELLHOLDER BASE £20.40
MTK MEPLAT TRIMMER KIT (REQUIRES HOLDER) £45.29
MTH-22 MEPLAT TRIMMER HOLDER .22 CAL £14.95
MTH-6 MEPLAT TRIMMER HOLDER 6mm £14.95
MTH-25 MEPLAT TRIMMER HOLDER .25 CAL £14.95
MTH-6.5 MEPLAT TRIMMER HOLDER 6.5mm £14.95
MTH-7 MEPLAT TRIMMER HOLDER 7mm £14.95
MTH-30 MEPLAT TRIMMER HOLDER .30 CAL £14.95
MTH-338 MEPLAT TRIMMER HOLDER .338 CAL £14.95

Alpha1 wrote:

The Gun Pimp wrote:OK I know - more fun but why not buy the actual itty bitty carbide pointing thing and just make the holder - you can it it from Hannam's. If you don't get the actual pointing tip spot on you'll ruin your bullets.

Because they are roughly £58 each and I don't want to pay that.

WHIDDEN GUNWORKS
PDS POINTING DIE SYSTEM (REQUIRES SLEEVE & INSERT) £245.50
PDS-22 POINTING DIE SLEEVE .22 CAL £57.75
PDS-6 POINTING DIE SLEEVE 6mm £57.75
PDS-25 POINTING DIE SLEEVE .25 CAL £57.75
PDS-6.5 POINTING DIE SLEEVE 6.5mm £57.75
PDS-7 POINTING DIE SLEEVE 7mm £57.75
PDS-30 POINTING DIE SLEEVE .30 CAL £57.75
PDS-338 POINTING DIE SLEEVE .338 CAL £57.75
PDI#0 POINTING DIE INSERT # 0 £57.75
PDI#1 POINTING DIE INSERT # 1 £57.75
PDI#2 POINTING DIE INSERT # 2 £57.75
PDB SHELLHOLDER BASE £20.40
MTK MEPLAT TRIMMER KIT (REQUIRES HOLDER) £45.29
MTH-22 MEPLAT TRIMMER HOLDER .22 CAL £14.95
MTH-6 MEPLAT TRIMMER HOLDER 6mm £14.95
MTH-25 MEPLAT TRIMMER HOLDER .25 CAL £14.95
MTH-6.5 MEPLAT TRIMMER HOLDER 6.5mm £14.95
MTH-7 MEPLAT TRIMMER HOLDER 7mm £14.95
MTH-30 MEPLAT TRIMMER HOLDER .30 CAL £14.95
MTH-338 MEPLAT TRIMMER HOLDER .338 CAL £14.95

I will have a go and point a couple of bullets if it doesn't work I will buy the shooting sheds version.

Alpha1 wrote:

bradaz11 wrote:so if it's not tapered, what are you doing to the tip of the bullet? I thought pointing would require you to put the tip into a taper to get it uniform?

Sorry I thought you were refering to the meplat trimmer.
The pointing tool is a different thing all together I will know better to morrow when I have had a go. Im guessing I will drill a small hole in the centre then cut a taper using a minature carbide cutter.
Or maybe a small carbide burr. I have a few of them.

Not really and no are the simple answers.

I build my tip tooling from 316 stainless steel however I have also built prototype tooling from brass and am still using it many years later so I do wonder if carbide tip tools are necessary.

The hole down the middle serves two functions, firstly it acts as a path for dirt, grease oil and similar to be pushed away from the tip of the bullet when pointing, secondly it acts as a theoretical minimum meplat size. The issue is drilling a small hole through a 25-30mm long piece of 316 stainless can be quite time consuming and drill breakage is an occupational hazard, especially so when you are drilling a 0.4mm/0.017" hole. So what I do is drill through from the back with a 2,5mm drill for a set distance, finish with a 0,4mm drill and then reverse the insert and cut the tipping chamber which in my case is conical form with a slight curve on the walls. This means the cutter is piloted and stops around 2,5mm before the 2,5mm diameter hole from the back.

Yes, I know I can pilot with the 0,4 then cut the chamber then reverse for the 2,5mm however I am using a micro adjust collet system which is clocked to virtually nothing and a tenth of a thou or so will make no difference. Plus I get less breakages this way as I am using shorter drill bits. (I only use Gehring)

My chamber cutters are my design and are solid carbide, however I still have a range of prototype cutters which are just silver steel spoon cutters machined and ground and then hardened in house.

The sleeves are machined from 6082T6 and I drill and ream the main diameter that holds the tip insert and spacer and drill and bore the reduced diameter for the bullet, why bore? Well I batch build the sleeves for either Forster or Redding dies and leave the minor bore piloted so I can then bore to suit whatever the order is for, so 22cal, 7mm, 30cal etc. I normally bore the minor 0,05mm over or a couple of thou for you imperial sorts and find this gives a nice sliding fit for the bullet, I also add a very slight radius to the front edge to aid the alignment of the bullet and prevent potential marking of the bullet jacket.

Everything is done with D6-1 micro adjust collet chuck systems (5C) so I know exactly what my axial and radial runout is. Accuracy wise, the tolerances I work to are exactly the same as I would to chamber a rifle.

I was always led to believe it's the back end of the bullet that has the most effect on a bullets performance, accuracy wise.
How's YOUR back end?

I went into the Shed full of good intentions then the phone rang. So I turned two Calligraphy fountain pens in ebonite. WHY. Because I love making them and I get paid for them and they look beautiful when they are polished up.

After a couple of hours in my shed, I now have a meplat trimming system that works with my L.E.Wilson trimmer. I can add other calibers to it just need to machine a suitable bullet holder.
I then moved on to machining ebonite for a couple of other projects I had to drill long accurate holes the first attempts did not go well but I got there in the end. It proved to be an expensive exercise I ruined quite a bit of ebonite before I got it right. My shed is actually a brick built building with a concrete floor and low roof it was stifling hot once the machines had been running for a while.
I then turned my attention to the bullet pointing thing having never actually seen a bullet pointing die I struggled to get my head around were to start and by this time I was melting and losing interest.
So I have sold and made money on the bespoke pens I have made to order so I can afford to buy one of the shooting sheds offerings and a mount for the Ruger precision with the profits. So if I decide to go down the bullet pointing route Ill let David at the shed do the work and cross his palm with silver.

Question: If you use a Redding micrometer die does it have to be caliber specific or can you use any caliber die. I have redding micrometer dies I have purchased in the past but all my full-bore reloading stuff tends to be L.E.Wilson the bulk of my jacketed bullet reloading is done using an arbor press. For my milsurp stuff I use a wamadet press. I also have a Lyman crusher single station but I very rarely use it nowadays.

dodgyrog wrote:I was always led to believe it's the back end of the bullet that has the most effect on a bullets performance, accuracy wise.
How's YOUR back end?

The same as your back end full of brown stuff.