The UK's Finest Independent Forum for Shooters and Gun Owners. Est 2010.

Lancs_Oakley wrote:

Blackstuff wrote:Well there you have it, virtually anything 'high-powered' or centre-fire that can fire rapidly is on the table. Are they even aware that a .50BMG gun can be made to produce less than 10,000ft/lb simply by altering the length of its barrel?!

Time to get writing (again!) peeps!

So what will happen to the gunsmiths who make a lot of money out of these firearms? Will they look to be compensated for lost income / opportunity?

Did that happen with the pistol ban?

As a 17yr old at the time and only shooting a friend of the families pistols (in the process of filling in my membership and FAC forms when the shooting happened), i'm not 100% on that side of it. I would certainly hope so, but strongly suspect not.

From what I remember, they were compensated for their stock, but not for loss of earnings etc..

I also seem to remember a couple of RFD's / gunsmiths ended up committing suicide over it...

From the consultation paper:

GENERAL ASSUMPTIONS & DATA
8. Police record 64 .50 calibre rifles are owned by individual and estimates by the NCA put importation of MARS rifles at around 400 in total.
19. It is not known how many Manually Actuated Release System rapid fire rifles there are in the UK, however after discussions with the manufacturer the NCA has estimated that there are around 400 owned by private individuals. There is only one importer of these rifles, who sells them at a cost of around £2,000. Assuming rifles hold their value over time; this would result in a cost to the government of £0.8 million.
20. The total one-off cost to the government is therefore expected to be between £0.99 million and £1.12 million.

BUT, in the above figure for the estimated compensation figure they have NOT factored in the SGC lever release rifles that I would imagine outsell the MARS by at least a factor of 5 to 1, possibly even 10 to 1 or higher.

When you factor in 2,000 to 4,000 SGC rifles @£2,000 each you are adding an extra 4 to8 £ Million to the compensation bill.... that is IF they decide to pay compensation.

Not a good situation

HH1 wrote:When you factor in 2,000 to 4,000 SGC rifles @£2,000 each you are adding an extra 4 to8 £ Million to the compensation bill.... that is IF they decide to pay compensation.

It's my understanding that the number of privately owned SGC LR rifles is very much towards the upper end of that estimate, if not exceeding it. You also have to consider the cost of the .223 and .308 rifles, which routinely retail for upwards of £4000 each.

A.J.P. wrote:

HH1 wrote:When you factor in 2,000 to 4,000 SGC rifles @£2,000 each you are adding an extra 4 to8 £ Million to the compensation bill.... that is IF they decide to pay compensation.

It's my understanding that the number of privately owned SGC LR rifles is very much towards the upper end of that estimate, if not exceeding it. You also have to consider the cost of the .223 and .308 rifles, which routinely retail for upwards of £4000 each.

That is a very good point A.J.P.

HH1 wrote:

A.J.P. wrote:

HH1 wrote:When you factor in 2,000 to 4,000 SGC rifles @£2,000 each you are adding an extra 4 to8 £ Million to the compensation bill.... that is IF they decide to pay compensation.

It's my understanding that the number of privately owned SGC LR rifles is very much towards the upper end of that estimate, if not exceeding it. You also have to consider the cost of the .223 and .308 rifles, which routinely retail for upwards of £4000 each.

That is a very good point A.J.P.

I've been told that around a thousand of the .223 rifles have sold to date. Disregarding the thousands of rifles chambered in 9x19mm and .45 ACP, and the recently launched .308; the cost of compensating simply the .223 rifles could approach £4,000,000. I certainly hope that registers with the government and HO when they consider the feedback to the consultation.

From the FCSA's statement, it appears that the HO have also severely underestimated the number of .50 cal rifles in private hands. Not to mention other rifles, capable of exceeding 10,000ft.lbf, which could be caught within the expanded scope of the consultation.

Are you referring to lever-release .223/.308s?? I would be amazed if the figure is anywhere near that, even counting 9mm/45ACP versions! The build time alone would be breath taking, I seem to remember my Speedmaster taking 2-3 months alone.

When they came out with the figure of '400' I took that to mean ALL MARS and Lever-release guns but obviously if there are the thousands of guns out there it would certainly change those cost figures, significantly!!

Blackstuff wrote:Are you referring to lever-release .223/.308s?? I would be amazed if the figure is anywhere near that, even counting 9mm/45ACP versions! The build time alone would be breath taking, I seem to remember my Speedmaster taking 2-3 months alone.

When they came out with the figure of '400' I took that to mean ALL MARS and Lever-release guns but obviously if there are the thousands of guns out there it would certainly change those cost figures, significantly!!

The figure of around 1000 relates specifically to .223 chambered SGC Lever Release rifles. The impact assessment is predicated solely on the Caledonian Classic Arms produced M.A.R.S. rifles.

Build time on SGC rifles seems significantly shorter than 2-3 months at present. One of mine was ready in about a week.

I enquired to SGC a few weeks ago and told max 14 days for a new LR.

A.J.P. wrote:

Blackstuff wrote:Are you referring to lever-release .223/.308s?? I would be amazed if the figure is anywhere near that, even counting 9mm/45ACP versions! The build time alone would be breath taking, I seem to remember my Speedmaster taking 2-3 months alone.

When they came out with the figure of '400' I took that to mean ALL MARS and Lever-release guns but obviously if there are the thousands of guns out there it would certainly change those cost figures, significantly!!

The figure of around 1000 relates specifically to .223 chambered SGC Lever Release rifles. The impact assessment is predicated solely on the Caledonian Classic Arms produced M.A.R.S. rifles.

Build time on SGC rifles seems significantly shorter than 2-3 months at present. One of mine was ready in about a week.

I think you've got your calibres wrong, approx 50 .223 SGC LR, well over 1000 9mm LR's.