The UK's Finest Independent Forum for Shooters and Gun Owners. Est 2010.

Many of you oomans contributed usefully (or humorously, sometimes even both) to our previous 'Build it with Badger' threads and those formed the basis for a long term plan we now have to acquire a high accuracy target rifle. We now have a new idea: the building of a rifle on a budget that is capable of providing good accuracy with low cost military surplus ammunition out to 600 mards and maybe to 1000 yards with paw loads.

The concept is this:

* The rifle will be chambered in 7.62x54R to permit the use of surplus canned bangs at 30 pennies per shot
* With milsurp canned bangs the rifle must be capable of hitting Farmer Giles in the swede at 600 mards and torso at 800 mards
* The rifle will be capable of sub MOA accuracy when using paw loads
* The rifle and any associated impedimentia must not exceed a total budget of £1000, including any smithing costs

Our initial thoughts revolve around:

Action:
Either a P14 or a Mosin Nagant.

We have a P14 that has been converted to 7.62x51mm and is in a cruddy stock so anything else done to it will only be an improvement. The P14 is a strong action, more than capable of pawdling the 7.62x54R, and we are told it is relatively easy to rebarrel. We think it ought to feed well too as the original .303 cartridge was a rimmed design with similar dimensions to the 7.62x54R, maybe one of you oomans can advise on that for us.

Alternatively, we could follow the routes the Finns took when developing their TKIV-85 and convert an existing Mosin Nagant action. These can be picked up cheaply and will definitely feed the round.

Barrel:
We are contemplating a Lothar Walther stainless steel barrel. These are made from a good grade of steel that is resistant to corrosion and erosion, more so than most in fact, and the cost appears reasonable. The barrel may be the most expensive component but arguably the most important too. Money spent here is worth it. We're budgeting a nominal £300.

Stock:
We like the idea of a Joe West wooden stock and are budgeting £350.

Scope
We have a Russian 8x56 POSP scope available and would then need to get appropriate mounts for the action chosen

Smithing
We'd probably ask ovenpaaa to assemble and proof this for us, posting here the progress made.


Over to you, oomans.

What's the complexity of re-barrelling a P14 over a Mosin? I've seen that the Mosin can be a bit of a bugger but the P14 doesn't look so simple either.
£300 for barrel? That's not bad.
Can you get hold of a UK-59 barrel? They're supposed to be great on the Mosins.

Will it need provision for a bayonet?

If you'd not stuck to 7.62x54 as the caliber I'd have said to get a Swede M96, drop it in a better stock, shove a scope on & job done.

Will have more ideas on the Finnish aspect of modernised M~N bangsticks once I've put the time in at the next Suomen Asehistoriallinen Seura show in a couple of weeks time.

No, it doesn't need to have a bayonet.

Yes, it *MUST* be 7.62x54R













We already have a Swedish M96, and very accurate it is too. That's another story.

Are you realistic about £300 for the barrel?
Is that buying the barrel and fitting or just the cost of the barrel?

If you are going for a Lothar Walther barrel in stainless, I would suggest that you go for a medium Palma profile.
Fitting plus proof will be a lot more than £300. The barrel blank alone is in excess of £300. Probably closer to £550-£600.
Of course if you went for a chrome moly barrel it would be cheaper but I would go with stainless.

Steve E wrote:If you are going for a Lothar Walther barrel in stainless, I would suggest that you go for a medium Palma profile.
Fitting plus proof will be a lot more than £300. The barrel blank alone is in excess of £300. Probably closer to £550-£600.
Of course if you went for a chrome moly barrel it would be cheaper but I would go with stainless.

We'll have to consult our email from Walther to refresh our memory on the exact price, but we think the cost of £300 was for a stainless barrel with a bull barrel profile. We like the particular grade of stainless steel Walther use (we're a metallurgist, so have an incy wincy idea of what we are talking about) and our view is that a heavy barrel is better than a lighter barrel. It's stiffer and has a higher thermal mass, thus takes more rounds through it afore it begins to expand and the point of impact departs from the point of aim.

A 32 inch 7.62x54R bull barrel was quoted at 385 Euros, oomans. That seems good value to us.

Have you considered an M39?. Heavier barrel than the Russki boomsticks. Much improved trigger. Loves milsurpski canned bangs. Don't know about farmer Giles but they certainly reduced the manpower of numerous farming collectives.
I disapprove of buggering around with rifles that carry the knocks earned in combat however a post war rebuild or unissued rifle might be a good candidate.

I even have a lead on a German dealer who has a number of unissued M39s (waiting for a reply to an E-mail to confirm).

We'd love a proper Suomi M39, but haven't seen a decent for sale for ages...

Our dream is a proper TKIV-85