The UK's Finest Independent Forum for Shooters and Gun Owners. Est 2010.

Hi Guys

A 22lr i'm looking at is lacking a serial number i have it on good advice that considering the manufacture era (1940s) and the situation ( wartime) that this should be ok as the first 2000 or so of them came into the country without numbers....


however externally the gun is in quite poor condition and its possible the marks were historically removed (looks a bit like a hammered stippling effect where they should be), internally its fine.

As it does not have proof marks either its going to be proofed before i potentially buy it anyway.
The trader is reputable and his gunsmith is quite happy with the gun.


so 3 questions

1) is lack of a number an issue?
2) If i suspect at some point in its history they were deliberately removed is that an issue
3) Will the proof house pick up on this if there is an issue?

Humm mind whirling ....... i do like the gun

Cheerho

No, there's shed loads of guns of all descriptions floating around without serial numbers. Some manufacturers didn't even bother numbering certain models. Usually entered on an FAC or SGC as "NVN" No Visible Number.

I have two firearms (Musket on my SGC and Flintlock on my FAC which have no serial number and are recorded and NVN, No visible number)

If it is legal, it is already recorded on the owners certificate, so no issues as it is a legal transfer as far as I am concerned..

The lack of serial numbers as said above isn't a problem, however in my opinion the lack of a visible proof mark is a big problem for a section 1 firearm. I believe it would be illegal to sell a section 1 firearm that hasn't passed proof and although this gun probably was proofed on import the absence of visible proof marks means there's no evidence it was ever submitted for proof. As you say who knows what happen in wartime and under what circumstances the gun landed on these shores.

A few years ago I bought an old (pre-68) Remington fieldmaster that was 'using' a poorly stamped 5 (or 6) digit number on the barrel as a serial number. I thought it looked odd and did a bit of checking on some US forums...turned out the number on the barrel was a parts number and the rifle didn't have a serial number at all. Appears that pre-1968 Gun Control Act the US didn't require .22rf firearms to have serial numbers (not sure about other calibers).
FYI: I spoke to my FEO about it and he couldn't have cared less....said to bring it up at my next renewel and they'd amend things then to show the rifle was no Visible Number.

Yes they do exist, we had a Stevens 310 shotgun come in last week, no visible number and no proof marks.

Prior to the Gun Control Act of 1968, no sporting firearms required serial numbers. Many manufacturers did not mark shotguns or .22 RF with serial numbers. Savage, Stevens shotguns often came without serial numbers, as well as the house brands for Sears, and Eaton's in Canada. I had a Savage Model 30D and a Ranger .22RF with no serial numbers. Most of the bigger companies did serial number centre fire rifles, though I believe they were not required by law to do so.

Well after everyone's replies (thank you all) and ringing Kranks and getting the helpful and cheerful younger chap i have decided to go for it.

I am still a little wary of the area where the number should be (that hammered stippling) but its likely the proof house would pick that up if a problem.

So have made the chap an offer.

See how it goes eh?

guys

Or you could save yourself a lot of time and effort and just consult your FEO/Licensing authority as it will be them that will be interpreting and applying the various acts to your grant.

Just saying like

I have posted the chosen gun in the show us your rimfires section.

A mossberg 42mb. shoots well and the rear sight (not on the pictures over there ) kind of works.

Just need to track down some spares.

cheerho