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Well worth a read - Offensive Weapons bill Committee Stage
Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2018 11:34 am
by nickb834
This is the minutes from committee stage where Ministers MP's Police are discussing the proposed ban on MARS and HME firearms (they mention 50, 14.5 and 20mm) of 13600J energy......
https://www.theyworkforyou.com/pbc/2017 ... rism#g31.6
Re: Well worth a read - Offensive Weapons bill Committee Sta
Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2018 2:20 pm
by shotgun sam
Thanks for bringing that to our attention it is quite interesting.
Sam
Re: Well worth a read - Offensive Weapons bill Committee Sta
Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2018 3:08 pm
by nickb834
There's a decent enough line of questioning about why ban these rifles if they've never been used in crime, one of the MP's queries the effect on disabled shooters of banning MARS.
Plods argument boils down to (for the energy limit argument):
- Too much energy at too greater distance
Allows yon criminals and terrorists to engage and destroy vehicles at distance
And that this is possible with simple 50BMG FMJ Ball ammunition as opposed to AP
So they want to ban them before they get into the hands of....
Plod does fess up to that no legally held 50 cal has been used in crime
But then trots out the 80's terrorist angle in NI.
Re: Well worth a read - Offensive Weapons bill Committee Sta
Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2018 3:14 pm
by nickb834
Argument against MARS is that too higher rate of fire, it's working against / around the S1 ban and so forth.
There's a lot of discussion about antique firearms etc, the don't like being able to possess shotgun cartridges without a ticket, but the committee understands that the controls on ammunition make it much harder to assemble ammunition for an obsolete calibre.
Upshot - I'm just giving a precis on what's been discussed.
My take personally, the 50 cals will survive, they won't adjust the security arrangements, but it's not looking good for MARS longer term. In the short term I think they'll survive in one form or another as it's too hard to define in law exactly what a MARS or lever release is - and the engineer will always find a way.
An MP did actually suggest by trying to tighten it up too much they'll leave loop holes - if only they'd followed it through with a - so lets open it back up again (Sec 5 semi autos back to S1) - sigh........ if only.
Re: Well worth a read - Offensive Weapons bill Committee Sta
Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2018 4:04 pm
by snayperskaya
I don't think enough was said to explain just how hard it is to get components for the majority of obsolete calibres, such as cases, especially in any sort of quantity and quality......or am I wrong?.
Re: Well worth a read - Offensive Weapons bill Committee Sta
Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2018 4:06 pm
by nickb834
no not enough was said on the topic - but, I'd argue it's not that hard - a lot of parent cases and a lot can be converted to use for something else - a la 20G brass to .577/450
Re: Well worth a read - Offensive Weapons bill Committee Sta
Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2018 5:31 pm
by Brian838
nickb834 wrote:Argument against MARS is that too higher rate of fire, it's working against / around the S1 ban and so forth.
There's a lot of discussion about antique firearms etc, the don't like being able to possess shotgun cartridges without a ticket, but the committee understands that the controls on ammunition make it much harder to assemble ammunition for an obsolete calibre.
Upshot - I'm just giving a precis on what's been discussed.
My take personally, the 50 cals will survive, they won't adjust the security arrangements, but it's not looking good for MARS longer term. In the short term I think they'll survive in one form or another as it's too hard to define in law exactly what a MARS or lever release is - and the engineer will always find a way.
An MP did actually suggest by trying to tighten it up too much they'll leave loop holes - if only they'd followed it through with a - so lets open it back up again (Sec 5 semi autos back to S1) - sigh........ if only.
Would be nice if they would grant grandfather rights on mars/lever release rather than an outright ban.
Re: Well worth a read - Offensive Weapons bill Committee Sta
Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2018 7:06 pm
by HALODIN
It's a shame no-one mentioned how unusable a cut-down .50 cal rifle would be without a crown and without a long barrel to stabilise the round. A cut-down .50 cal rifle is no more lethal than a .308 and the recoil and noise would be horrendous. It would only be used once in anger!
Re: Well worth a read - Offensive Weapons bill Committee Sta
Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2018 8:22 pm
by bradaz11
Brian838 wrote:
Would be nice if they would grant grandfather rights on mars/lever release rather than an outright ban.
not all shooters share that view. I would rather have something I could sell if I wanted to
Re: Well worth a read - Offensive Weapons bill Committee Sta
Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2018 8:34 pm
by artiglio
bradaz11 wrote:Brian838 wrote:
Would be nice if they would grant grandfather rights on mars/lever release rather than an outright ban.
not all shooters share that view. I would rather have something I could sell if I wanted to
But, would it not be reasonable to offer owners either compensation or grandfather rights as a one time choice?