Newbie TR wants your advice/opinion.

[R.G.C]

£2750 is pricey for a 2nd hand RPA - a new one in full fig with Gemini stock and fully adjustable sights comes in at about £3600 - so unless it's ex-showroom it's overpriced.

Be careful with Paramounts. The two you list are (by the serials) near the first and last in the production run. The Paramount has a design weakness in that the primary extraction is forced by a cam cut into the bolt handle movement slot. If it is cut incorrectly, there is very little that can be done to fix it. That said, if they are right in that respect, Paramounts are very good and robust guns. The prices are on the high side of average, but if the stock is in good condition, the sights are serviceable without backlash and the barrel is on the low side of half worn, they may be worth the money.

The Swing at £1400 may be a good buy, but you do need to look carefully. Which mark is it - they got better as they went on, and the Mk5 has a number of detail advantages over its predecessors. Does the bolt work smoothly? - Swings are hard to open compared with most guns. How old is the barrel? A new barrel is £600 worth before you start. What sights are on it? How is the stock and, in particular, the bedding?

I own both a Swing Mk5 and an RPA Quadlock. The Swing is 35 years old, the QL 10. Both shoot to international standards. The Swing is the one that set records. The QL is more comfortable to work, but a bit heavy to handle.

Iain

Iain,

To the best of my knowledge, the Swing MK5 were made in 1988-1989?
R.G.C

[IainWR]

Robert, you may well be right now I think about it. I had a mk4 in a Standard rifle-style stock for a few years.

Iain

[Dougan]

My Paramount has shot very well for a long time. There have been no problems with reliability.

...and several Queens finalists and winners are happy with them too...

[Dougan]

I like the Swing as well but can't help wondering why no one else has taken it up for so long?

The stiff bolt lift would rule it out for some, especially if their budget will extend to an easier action to operate - The other thing is barrel life...not such an issue if you're only shooting 500 rounds a season, but you'd be amazed how many rounds some TR shooters put down each year...

That said - I've spoken to Robert at Fultons, who has confirmed that it is a 30" barrel which is about half way through it's life; so still 2000/2500 shots left...

...there is also another Swing Mk.4 in the shop (not on the website yet) that is virtually the same but without the aluminium spacers on the butt; and Robert reckons it's just got the edge on barrel life...currently priced at £1450.

Personally I like thumb-hole stocks with adjustable bits and bobs, but it would be worth trying them...if they're comfortable for you then not an issue...

...Robert also confirmed that you can try any of them out on the range whenever you like.

[GazMorris]

I would recommend going to Ron Hilyard (Thames Valley Arms) and getting a new Barnard - spend a bit more but it will hold it's value.

A second vote for the quality of Ron's work. I shoot one of his Barnards with a Bartlein barrel in a Mastin-alike stock with adjustable cheekpiece and have been very happy with it.

Coming back to the original post, though, all of the rifles are £400 or more over the odds IMHO. This is why they have a bunch of them in the shop that they have not been able to sell for ages. Now I've got that off my chest, most of them will probably do the job well enough from a pure accuracy standpoint; although do not consider anything with a barrel less than 30" in length or with a twist slower than 1/13" (i.e. 1/13.5" and 1/14" should not be considered.) At this point, the most important factor will be the fit of the stock. Take the rifles out and try them out on the range if they will let you. It shouldn't take you more than a few shots to determine if each rifle it suitable or not. If they won't let you shoot them, consider walking away and trying elsewhere (although this doesn't seem to be a problem.)

Best of luck!

GazM

[Christel]

I would recommend going to Ron Hilyard (Thames Valley Arms) and getting a new Barnard - spend a bit more but it will hold it's value.

A second vote for the quality of Ron's work. I shoot one of his Barnards with a Bartlein barrel in a Mastin-alike stock with adjustable cheekpiece and have been very happy with it.

Coming back to the original post, though, all of the rifles are £400 or more over the odds IMHO. This is why they have a bunch of them in the shop that they have not been able to sell for ages. Now I've got that off my chest, most of them will probably do the job well enough from a pure accuracy standpoint; although do not consider anything with a barrel less than 30" in length or with a twist slower than 1/13" (i.e. 1/13.5" and 1/14" should not be considered.) At this point, the most important factor will be the fit of the stock. Take the rifles out and try them out on the range if they will let you. It shouldn't take you more than a few shots to determine if each rifle it suitable or not. If they won't let you shoot them, consider walking away and trying elsewhere (although this doesn't seem to be a problem.)

Best of luck!

GazM

The barrel length and the twist, yes as long as we are talking .308 as other cartridges and calibres will need different considerations.
I am only adding this because someone in the future might read this and not realise the discussion is purely about .308

[Jabberwocky413]

Cheers again folks, I feel like I'm far better informed on these rifles now and can ask the right questions about them when I'm next down there. Thanks for taking the time to ring Fultons for me John and sorting out the barrel length question, we will have to sort out a pre season practice shoot when the Sun returns and maybe test a couple of them?
Thanks to you all for taking time out to answer my questions I do appreciate it and maybe one day I can return the favour.

[Dougan]

No probs mate...give it a month or so and we can get onto Tony, Rog and the others for a pre-season session...

[amyjane]

I just spotted a few Swing's on Gunstar - ranging from £525 to £1500.

http://www.gunstar.co.uk/swing-7-62mm-r ... les/507133

http://www.gunstar.co.uk/swing-7-62mm-r ... ifles/6589

[Gaz]

That one for £525 looks like a decent bargain on the surface, although it almost certainly will need a new barrel and a new rearsight at the very least ... so actually, if you buy a new barrel (~£600) and foresight/rearsight pair, you're looking at spending around £1000 already. Probably less if you can get the sights secondhand, or just opt for a rearsight alone and muddle through with the fixed foresight on the rifle already.

The £750 one probably needs a new barrel, but other than that looks complete and ready to go. Must be an early model!